Life North of the 54th

Transcript

• 00:00 - From Dietrich to Dawson Creek
• 10:57 - Settling in Around Dawson Creek
• 23:20 - Homesteading
• 36:24 - Some Additional Stories

00:00 - From Dietrich to Dawson Creek

Opening Theme Music:
[bass guitar riff]

Garett:
Welcome to Life North of the 54th. I'm Garett Brown.

Preston:
And I'm Preston Brown and welcome to our show.

Janie:
For Life North of the 54th, my name is Janie Myers, and I spent 27 years in Northern BC in Alberta. So that's why we're talking about Life North of the 54th.

Garett:
So, Grandma, I don't know how much Preston has told you, but he did tell me that you had thought about writing a book called Life North of the 54th or a memoir or something.

Janie:
I've had that on my mind for a number of years. Yeah. [laughs] Because I've kind of kept journals over the years. They're all stashed away.

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
And Joleen has spoken for them. [chuckles]

Preston:
You know, Grandma, we want to have a set up for a podcast. And what we really want to do is have some family history from you, have some stories and things from you. How do you feel about sharing that video recording like this?

Janie:
Yeah. And another thought that came across me. So are you going to want to know, because it's a Peace River country, which you're mostly interested in getting some historical facts and stuff on? Because, I mean, I can give you some other names, too, if you want to contact people.

Garett:
Yeah. I think it would be fine to talk to anybody who, like, I think from my experience, if you meet anybody and you talk to anybody about their story, everybody has an interesting story to share, it's okay to talk to anybody. We'd like to start by talking with you.

Janie:
[chuckles]

Garett:
Since you know a lot more than we do.

Janie:
That's good.

Preston:
We're comfortable having uh, being guinea pigs here. [chuckles]

Janie:
That's good. Sure.

Garett:
But it's mostly, like in terms of facts, history is tricky thing. Eyewitness accounts are tricky things.

Janie:
Yup.

Garett:
We just want to know stories. It's not super important to know exactly when or where or what.

Janie:
Exact dates. Yeah.

Garett:
We know, Grandma, that you have stories that we haven't heard, and we think it's better to hear the stories than it is to just never hear them because we're afraid that they might be inaccurate.

Janie:
No. Ken always tells a lot of stories about his parents and his dad telling stories. But even with me and my sister and brother, we get to talking about something. And my mom just passed two and a half years ago, and you go along and you're talking about something and it's like, oh, I wish I could ask mom that question, see what her memory says. [chuckles fondly] And she's not here to ask anymore. And that's a little, you know... That gets... You know, and my dad died when he was 48. So I haven't been able to ask him questions for a long, long time. Like, Ken and his siblings should have recorded a lot of their dad's stories because they were just hilarious and great history stuff. And too many people miss out on that to be able to pass them down. So recording it will be kind of cool.

Garett:
Yeah. We hope that it well, firstly, recording is a lot easier.

Janie:
Yes, it is.

Garett:
It's way easier to just talk and have it done.

Janie:
Well, that's what I always thought I would write the book then I can just talk into the computer and let it do the printing.

All:
[chuckle]

Preston:
And also the spoken word does have a little bit different effect than the written word. Both are quite significant.

Garett:
I totally agree, because that's the thing here. I can text all day long with the kids or whatever or you guys, but to hear those inflections in the voice, you get a better feel of what's actually going on. So I still like to talk directly.

Preston:
Absolutely. Are there certain stories that you would really like to have this here?

Janie:
Oh, I don't know. You guys have to ask the question.

Preston:
Yeah. Somewhere between asking the right questions to get the good stories. So Grandma, you're not originally from Northern Alberta, British Columbia, though, are you?

Janie:
No. I came from Southern Idaho, little tiny town, grew up in a little town that had 118 for population, farming community. And that's not the only place I lived. We moved around a lot when I was a kid. Last year I was in high school, I was dating a guy, and he had been, his name was John LeVon Meservy, and had previously been to Northern British Columbia and filed on some land with a friend of his. And in the summer of 1966, he and a school buddy had gone to Northern British Columbia and worked on the W.A.C. Bennett Dam. I think that was the first year of construction for it. In February of 1967, Von and his dad Hyrum and his brother Udell all made a trip to Peace River, Alberta, because that was where the agency was. It had control of the land in Northern BC. The area was called Peace River District, and there were lot numbers. Anyway, so Von's dad and his brother filed on some land up there, too. And then they came home from there and started the process of immigrating into Canada, which was quite a process, getting rid of their property. I don't know if Udell owned anything, but I think Hyrum was losing his land because of having major heart attacks a few years prior to that and all the medical bills. And that's one of the reasons I think they were thinking about moving that trip to Peace River was a 30 hour drive at that time. It doesn't take that long now because of the freeways they've put in since then. But I can just remember them commenting about 30 hours of driving time to get up there and they were gone most of a week and back. That's the process of getting ready to go because Von and his dad had horses and his mom had a German Shepherd dog. And so all of those things have to be federally inspected by a federal vet in order to get across the border. So there was lots of details. I remember his dad filled out paperwork that had to be done in triplicate. The stuff that was coming with them at the time they were going across and stuff that was being left behind that they might go back for, farming equipment and different things. So they had two trucks. One had stock racks on it and they carried fuel in the very front end and the horses in the other part of it. And I think there was at least four, if not six horses, I don't remember for sure. Then the other truck was full of all of their furniture and some food storage and things like that from the cellar. Udell had a pickup and I know it was loaded and Udell's wife drove his pickup. Von had a pickup and it was loaded. I don't know if it was in Von's pickup or Udell's where the cage was where Vera's dog rode. Vera and Hyrum had a car and Udell and Maryland's little girl Dawn was about two at the time and she rode with Grandpa and Grandma in the car because she'd have the back seat all to herself. It took us a few days to get up there because we left Dietrich and I think we were in Dillon, Montana and the motor went out of the truck that you Udell was driving. So they had to find somebody, had to find a place to unload the horses and keep them and find a mechanic that could work on the truck. And I think we were there two and a half days and then took off again in the afternoon. And I remember that night we drove and we pulled over somewhere, but we slept along the Missouri River somewhere. And then the next day I think we crossed into Canada into Lethbridge and they gave the horses a break and found some fairgrounds where we unloaded the horses and got motel rooms and spent the night.

Garett:
What time of year was it?

Janie:
May. I think it was May 2nd we left, it was right around that first week of May. See, my graduation wasn't until about the 20th or the 25th of May. And I got clearance from the school to leave and still got my diploma, even though I left a bit early because I had straight A's that year, pretty much. Anyway.

Preston:
Grandma, did you have any complications crossing the border into Canada?

Janie:
Yes, because I was under 18. I was not married and the White Slave Act laws were still in place. And I think they had to have the animals checked by federal inspector and stuff when we got to the border. But I can remember Hyrum and Vera being in a room with somebody for a long time. I didn't know what was going on until after they come out. And it's like they had to be totally responsible, even though my mom had given me a notarized letter to get married because I was underage, I still was a single person and I don't know what all they told an immigration officer to get me across the border without a lot of hype, but it took an hour or two. I know we were hung up there for quite a while for that. Yes. There was a lot of things. [laughs]

Garett:
Was that at the Sweet Grass crossing?

Janie:
Yes, I'm pretty sure we went through Sweet Grass.

Garett:
It's north of Great Falls, Montana, on the way to Lethbridge, Alberta.

Janie:
Yeah. And then it was night time when we met the fair grounds. We unloaded horses. And I remember the next day when they were trying to load them, they said whoa those horses didn't want to get back on that truck. It took them a lot to convince the horses to go back on the truck and ride some more. I know it was night time when we went through Edmonton and like, you know, here we are, this caravan of five vehicles, not knowing exactly where we were going. And Udell was leading, and dark. And then that's the first experience of traffic circles [laughs] in driving. And the next day, I suppose the next day we probably got into Dawson Creek. But we must have stopped somewhere along the way and slept that night because I know it was daytime when we hit Grande Prairie. And I just remember driving from White Court to Grande Prairie. It's two lane road and the road closed in and there's just nothing but trees. It was such a boring, boring drive for all those miles and getting into Grande Prairie. And then it finally, stuff opened up a bit and then got into Dawson Creek. And then they got motel rooms and stuff. Von and I stayed with some people we knew from Dietrich that were living in Dawson Creek. Floyd and Nadine Gage. And we got married on June 2nd. And we lived with Nadine and Floyd for a couple of months. I don't even remember what the time frame was until we found a place to rent outside of town. And Von went to work for an auto body shop and Udell went and found a job. I know Hyrum and Ver were in a motel for a while.

10:57 - Settling in Around Dawson Creek

Garett:
So you were talking about how they filed for the land?

Janie:
Yeah. You applied for land in BC. BC allowed for foreigners to own land. Alberta never did. That's why we never settled in Alberta. It was British Columbia. So you applied or filed on some land and it was like homesteading. So there was a yearly fee and then there was parameters set up that you had to clear and break so many acres out in a specified amount of time. When you got that done, there was an amount already set up where you would pay and then you would own the land outright. So I kind of remember it was like $173 a year for each section. And it seems like it was 240 acres had to be cleared and broke up ploughed and stuff so it could go into crop.

Garett:
Okay.

Janie:
I don't know if it was a five year period whenever it was, but it seemed like in the purchase of that was, like, just over $4,000. Then that purchased, like, 1280 acres, two sections of land.

Garett:
Yeah, that's a lot.

Preston:
Yeah, that's like 2 miles by 1 mile, right?

Janie:
Yeah. And they were right together. I don't know if Hyrum and Udell applied on land in the same valley where Von had and another friend from Dietrich that had gone up the Von and originally filed on land, he got sections just north of us, but he never did ever go in there. I think he gave it up because he decided it was too much work. And they eventually went back to after four or five years. They didn't stay in Canada, but the school buddy of bonds that he went to work with on the dam that year, he married a girl from Alabama or Georgia. She had a bit of an accent, [chuckles] but I think he went into services, and that's when he met her and stuff. But anyway, he eventually followed his mum and dad up there, and he still lives in Canada, and I think he's in the Lethbridge area now.

Garett:
So when you went up there and you were staying in Dawson Creek, and Von was working at an automotive shop, during that time were you also having to go up to the land and clear land?

Janie:
No, we didn't do anything that summer. I just remember us going up there in the fall to hunt. When we got into Dawson Creek, Von did know somebody that worked at the railroad station. He must have gotten to know him the year before when he was up there. And anyway, I remember us going to visit him and stuff, and he was asking around because he had the horses, and they needed to find some pasture for the horses. And that's when we were given Alan Lowe's name out there at mile 22, 23. So we went out to look him up and found him and visited with him. Yup, he was willin. He had pasture. And so the horses wound up going out there. Hyrum rented a piece of ground just across the road, you know that big farm that was at mile 26 between Dawson and Fort St. John? Do you guys remember it?

Preston:
On the old highway now.

Janie:
Yeah.

Garett:
I don't. I don't recall it.

Janie:
Coming up a big hill and going down a big hill. And it was off to the south of the highway, and it was a big corporation farm, but Hyrum had rented a little piece across the road from it planning to put in some, I think they did oats, it's either oats or barley. Anyway, so he was farming that. They farmed that. And I remember us helping. We picked rocks there and did some things, and then there was another piece of ground out in what they call Tower Lake, where the Kiskatinaw dumped into the Peace River back in there, that was called the Tower Lake area. He found some ground to farm out there because I remember they took a sheep wagon and him and grandma went out there and stayed and he was working that piece of land, and we went out there a couple of times to see him. Now the Hutterite Colony owns all that land out there.

Garett:
Okay, did you guys have equipment that, to work the land or did you buy it when you got to Dawson or rent it or borrow it?

Janie:
We didn't haul any equipment up, so Von bought an old 203 Massey, it had steel wheels from an outfit in Dawson Creek. Dunk Irvin was the guy that owned the dealership and we had to have sponsors. That's another thing about when we immigrated in, everybody had to have a sponsor. And so Dunk Irvin was our sponsor. Von kind of made a deal with him when Kim was a baby. We lived in the top of his, in '68, '69, of his building there where the dealership was, because Von was painting tractors and stuff for him that winter to rent. And we were staying in town and Kim was a baby because she was born in March. And so this was that following winter, and that was the winter it turned brutally cold. It dropped, I don't know if it was, I think in December it dropped down to like 40 below. Stayed there for six solid weeks. Never warmed up above 40 below in the daytime either. It was... [exhales]. I mean, it was like a dead town because nobody was out and about and getting around it. But I can remember a couple of times [chuckles] we'd go around and drive by the high school and here because miniskirts were the big thing then. And those girls are out there wearing miniskirts and that bloody cold weather. And I thought, man, are they stupid.

All:
[chuckle]

Janie:
That cold. Oh, my gosh. Yeah, it was crazy.

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
And snowmobiles were just getting to be a real craze at that time. And radio announcers were warning people all the time not to go out in that cold weather because you'd burn your lungs. It was brutal. So I don't know where we were living after that. I know we rented that place just out there at mile 26, just down, just north of where that big corporation farm was. And we lived there a couple of years in that little house. That building is no longer there. And then grandpa and grandma had found a place out on Tower Lake Road, and they were living out there. Udell went to work in Fort St. John. I don't know if you know where the Pomeroy Hotel is in Fort St. John. It's just right behind the Safeway that's just off the highway.

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
He worked there as a carpenter. I know Maryland was a nurse by trade, but I don't know if she worked in the beginning there. I don't know because she didn't like the rest of us very much so we never communicated much with her, so that's how we got there. And so where Safeway is, and just north across the street from Safeway, there was this little bitty building on the corner there of Main Street and the Alaska Highway in Fort St. John. And that's where your Grandpa Brown worked. That's where we first met, the Browns, because that's where we got tires fixed and stuff.

Preston:
Nice.

Garett:
Yeah. I was going to say that I've worked in that tire shop.

Janie:
Yeah. It's not the same building now, but that's where they originally started out.

Garett:
About the same spot, though.

Janie:
Yeah. Uncle Jim was pretty much the same spot where he was running the tire shop. So that's how those guys got into being managers of tire stores because of Lawrence. They did fine. They made good living that way.

Preston:
Yeah. You know, Grandma, what were some of your first impressions when you went up there? Because you weren't the one to go and scout the area. You just kind of came with everyone else when it was time to go.

Janie:
Well, the summers were nice because it never got too hot. But you're just kids and you're young and you're in love with somebody and like, you're just going along with everything. I got kind of lonesome. I don't remember us... I don't remember when we got a phone in, but I was writing my mom, but my mom didn't answer my letters very often, and it bothered me a little bit. And I was talking to Vera one day and she says, well, your mom knows you're okay because you're writing all the time. She says you quit writing her, she'll be writing and wanting to know how you are. So I did not send a letter for a couple of weeks. I got a letter from my mom.

All:
[laugh]

Janie:
Like when Uncle James went on his mission, there was a six week period I didn't get letters from him because he had been really good about writing, and so did I. And that really started to worry me. And it took me a while to get a phone number so I could call the mission home down there. And it took about four tries with all the time differences, until I finally got a hold of somebody that actually spoke some English, so I could understand what was being said. And I got hold of the Mission President. And so I told him who I was and why I was calling, that I hadn't got any letters from him. And so I was just a little bit worried. And he says, well, I just happened to have him in my office having an interview. Would you like to talk to him for a minute? So I got to talk to him for a minute.

Garett:
[chuckles] That was when he was in Sao Paulo, Brazil.

Janie:
Yeah. They'd gone on a postal strike, and nobody was sending out mail. And he says, mom, those letters will be lost forever from what I understand, because when they start up moving the mail again, he says everything that's piled up there, they're just going to throw it in a dumpster. They're not going to deal with it. So I have no idea what the lost letters were, but I did keep all of his letters from this mission. And I have one of yours.

Preston:
Grandma, I remember you talking about living in the Cleardale area. So what kind of took you from the Dawson Creek area to the Alberta side of the border?

Janie:
Well, because where we lived between Dawson Creek and Fort St. John, we didn't own any of that land. And so we didn't put in hay up north. We would take the cows up north for the summer and pasture them because it's really good pasture ground and grows good grass and lots of pvine(?) and batch(?) and stuff. So the year Kim was a year old and we put up hay in Rolla, which is over towards Spirit River from Dawson Creek, but it's still on this side of the river and we put hay up over there. And so we decided we'd just haul the hay up to the cows, because we didn't really have any place to put them. And it was like 100 miles one way to go from Rolla to where the cows were up at 109. And so every two or three days we'd load up a pickup and a trailer full of hay and drive up there, stay the night with Alan and where the cows were, and unload the hay, and then come back down to mile 109, and then the next day we'd go Rolla and load up hay again. And we'd have a flat tire on the pickup or the trailer every trip we made that winter. And so we figured we could put up hay around there around mile 23 and bring the cows down. There was a lot less loads of moving the cows back down. That's when we built corrals and stuff. Grandpa had bought this little acreage. It was twelve acres there on the highway. And so we built corrals and a loafing shed and stuff. And in the meantime, Grandpa had gotten sheep and he had put up a barn for them. And then so we started finding places to put hay up on shares and hay around that area there between there and Baldonnel and right down on the Beaton River. One year we put some hay up down there, too, and get straw from people if you could. So we didn't own ground where we could put up our own hay and stuff. So it was too expensive to buy it around there. So that's when Alan said he knew all of this, because he was from Goodlow and Goodlow was named after him. And he said over there he knew there was this new area that had opened up in the early 60s and land would be cheap over there. And so he took Von over there and introduced him to people he knew in the Cleardale area. And then he started asking around about places for sale. And that's when we found there was those six quarters we bought for $33,000 was all it was. Yeah. So in '75 is when we made the move into Alberta. So in the meantime, it's when all those communes were starting up up there north of Fort St. John, they weren't Hutterites. They were just a bunch of Christians getting together and trying to get out of the cities. And I think they were looking for land to buy, and we sold the property on Blair Creek. I don't remember. We only got $10,000 or $12,000 out of it. It's kind of a number I remember, but I honestly don't know that for a fact.

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
But it was still difficult getting in and out of there, just being up there this past summer, how much it had changed in the last two years, and how many more roads and facilities have been built in there on that side of the highway. It's just unbelievable.

Garett:
In the Cleardale area?

Janie:
No, that 109, 120 up there where Joleen has land. That area. How much has changed?

Garett:
Oh, yes.

23:20 - Homesteading

Garett:
So what led from you living in the Dawson Creek area to living up by mile 109?

Janie:
We were in there when we were building it, and Kim was just two. And then James was like, he was born in September. So the following summer, we spent the summer up there, you know part of the summer, because then we'd go down and put up hay. And Alan stayed up there all the time, and he kept an eye on the cows and stuff. But I can remember the one time Alan and I and Kim were in there, there wasn't a door on the cabin. Not all the roof was done. And he had built the little building that has stayed intact the best was a little smoke house he built, one of the first buildings he built. Anyway, Von went out, I can't remember why he went out, when he went out to get hay or work on corrals or get things ready to bring the cows home. I don't remember the situation for sure, but Alan and I and Kim stayed in there, and I can remember I always worried about bears. So we'd sleep in the farthest corner, away from where the door was. And I'd put Kim next to the wall, then me, then Alan, so they'd have to get him first if they come in kind of thing [laughs]

Garett:
[chuckles]

Janie:
Sleeping on the dirt in there. Yeah. It was crazy. Really primitive.

Preston:
That was on 109, right?

Janie:
That was how that land was accessed, was on the 109 road.

Preston:
Yeah.

Janie:
And then it branched off the 109 road, which was called the Gundy, and came into John and Dennis' place. And we had built a skid shack that we left on their place, and we come in and we kept groceries there and then if we got in late, we could stay there for the night and then the next morning go on over because there was no road in. We backpack stuff across the creek and walk over the hill and get supplies into Alan. He built a little corral on that Gundy road, about 5 miles in off the highway. That's where we'd haul the cows into. We'd unload them there and then we'd have the horses. I'd go in front and call the cows and they'd follow me and Alan and Von would walk behind and we'd walk them in. And then we'd walk them in across the creek into Blair Creek. And that's how we'd move them out.

Preston:
You actually did real cattle drives like the movies.

Janie:
Yes, it was. Yes, it was. I mean, we didn't have lots of animals. We only had 30 to 40 cows to begin with and going in there and up to 60 and keeping the heifers and stuff and then it got to be too much to take the cows up there and they opened up this big pasture at, I think they call it Sunset Prairie there south of Dawson Creek. We pastured there for a couple of years before we moved into Alberta.

Garett:
Was it a big ordeal to move that's a few miles down the road from mile 109 to Dustin? It's like 100 miles at least?

Janie:
Well, yeah, with the truck, you know. And remember the one time it was raining, we were coming out of there and the truck slid off the road and the back wheel was in the ditch and I don't remember how we got it out of there. Cows all loaded up with cows and stuff. There was always hitches in the program. It's a lot of work.

Garett:
I guess, do you want to tell us about the mud then?

Janie:
The mud?

Garett:
Yes, the mud of the Peace Country.

Janie:
We were coming out, we had a little Massey 30 and we were pulling it on a trailer, pretty sure it was the international pickup, and coming up out of the Gundy Creek, there was a fairly steep pitch in that hill and a u-joint went out and dropped the drive shaft and you're like, okay.

Garett:
[chuckles]

Janie:
Then we had to walk out of there and it was raining. It had rained and we had rubber boots and Kim was little. We had her wrapped in a coat and had his hat over the opening to keep the rain off of her and packing her out. And the mud. You know how the mud balls up on your rubber boots and the mud walk and then those balls just start walking up your boots and it'll walk up to your crotch and you've got about 40 pounds of weight on those boots.

Garett:
[chuckles]

Janie:
And we had a five mile walk. It was horrible. And got out to the highway and got a ride and got into Won-o-won. I think we got a motel room and we called his dad to come and get us. It was terrible. Now that was a big event.

Garett:
That's quite the ordeal!

Janie:
And one time in the middle of the winter! We got stranded in there with Kim the same way it must have been that same winter. Pick up broke down on us, so we walked back into the cabin and it was about 30 below that night. I remember it being crystal clear and we were really worried about getting frostbite and trying to keep her bundled up. And I just remember I got one wee little bit of frostbite on the end of my nose, but I don't think anybody else got anything. We were really lucky, really lucky because it was about 30 below and it would be like a three or four or five mile hike back into the cabin from where we were at, too. Those are not fun things. That's 10:00 at night. [chuckles] It's never in the daytime. Seems like stuff like that happening. And the move to Alberta because that highway 64 was not finished between Fort St. John and Cleardale. So you had to drop down through Cherry Point, Bear Canyon and a big loop around to get back up and then cross that Clear River. So for the most part hauling a bunch of equipment and stuff over. When we moved, we went through Rolla and crossed on the ferry with loads of stuff. And that scared the crap out of me because I don't like water [chuckles] that much. Since then, they put a bridge across there. But for a long time, going back over to see Grandpa and Grandma, we'd crossed the ferry and come that way until they finished that 64 road. And we would go for St. John Way and go down to see Grandpa and Grandma because it was about the same mileage, but then we didn't have to cross the ferry. So it was a little faster when you had to wait on the ferry and stuff. But that was a big deal, moving all that stuff.

Janie:
When Jessie was little, she'd always fall asleep. We'd go down the Toots and Albert (Campbell) to get hay and she'd be asleep in the vehicle before we get back. Or like it was 50 miles into Fairview or 80 miles going over to Grandpa and Grandma and she'd fall asleep all the time. So, you know, when she got four or five years old, she rather stay home somewhere with somebody then go in that car because she hated going to sleep all the time. Till one day she finally made it all the way and ah! Okay, now cars aren't so bad because it doesn't put me to sleep. [laughs] It was just one day there was a click. [laughs] It was funny.

Preston:
When you bought the land in Cleardale, it wasn't quite like the homestead for filing for land, right? You just bought the land from another owner and then you didn't have to clear land or anything, right?

Janie:
Yeah. We borrowed through an agency called Alberta Development Corporation, kind of like a farm credit, that kind of thing. Yeah, a lending agency. But he eventually was going to lose it because we kept losing money. And in the 80s, like, we had an operating loan through the bank. And in the early 80s, like, the interest rate went to 21%. It was terrible. And, you know, price of cattle, like, we were getting like $125 a calf. So those things don't compute real well.

Garett:
No. No.

Preston:
What were the hospitals and medical services like up there in the 1960s?

Janie:
Well, I never thought too much about it. We I mean, went and did all of our doctor visits and the hospital was always there in Dawson Creek because I had three kids in Dawson Creek. When I was pregnant with James, the doctor I had, and I told him, you know like, we were up at 109 a lot and stuff, I said, I never know when I'm going to be here. How can I make appointments? He said, when you're in town, you just come and tell them you're coming to see me and I'll just make sure you get in the days you're in town and you're down here and stuff. So he worked with me really well. They were accommodating. They understood the mechanics of being homesteaders, I think.

Garett:
You're not really going to have an on call doctor when you never know how many miles of mud you might have to drive through to get somewhere and you might not even have a phone to call them.

Janie:
No. That's the thing. Yeah. The lack of communication. It's amazing we survived that. When you think about having cell phones and being able to check on people nowadays and stuff. It's a whole different ball game altogether. Yeah, and that was always a worry. If Von and Al took off and they said how long they might be gone and they don't show up. Like, what are you supposed to do? Can't call them, can't go check on them. I don't have another vehicle, that kind of stuff. You just have to wait and hope everything is okay kind of thing.

Garett:
Did it lead to a lot of feeling anxious or did you just learn to live with not knowing?

Janie:
It would depend knowing what they were doing. Like, if I knew he was around machinery, if he's out changing the tire, I know things could fall off a jacks and stuff. You would worry some, depending on what you knew they were all doing. If they were just going to see people and chatting, then, you know, well, they always say women talk a lot, but no, men talk a lot. [laughs] They visit. They really visit, get carried awa. And they don't pay attention to time.

Garett:
Yeah, I think humans in general always have something to talk about.

Janie:
Like when James got hurt, I was in town running errands and picking up parts and stuff, and I got to a part store and somebody says, Are you so and so? Yup. Well, we just got a call from somebody that said your son's been taken to the hospital and you need to go there. Well, that kind of throws you for a loop. Go to the hospital and find out what's going on. Those things kind of scare you.

Garett:
Yeah. Yeah, I feel like nowadays if you went to some automotive shop or something and somebody says, hey, are you so and so you kind of look like the person described on the phone. You got to go to the hospital because so and so had something happen and it's much less trustworthy, I don't know. I just wouldn't trust, like, are you trying to pull my leg? I don't know what's going on here.

Janie:
Yeah. Even then it's like, well, how come you know something I don't know? Because, of course, nobody has a phone. So how they track me down happens to get ahead of whatever my schedule was of getting parts. I don't know how many phone calls they might have made that day trying to get a message to me. Yeah. And in that experience, there Von picked up a hitchhiker. He went to Fort St. John for some reason one day, and he came back and he's got this Brazilian kid who was hitchhiking, and we had him around for a while. He stayed with us for a while there in BC, and then when we were in Alberta, he came over and he stayed with us for a while over there, too. He hung around in Canada for a while, and then he went back to Brazil and we stayed in contact for quite a number of years.

Garett:
I've picked up a few hitchhikers, but they seem less common now and people trust them less.

Janie:
Well, I was always really careful. I've always been really nervous about picking up anybody. Always have been. It was quite a common thing back then.

Garett:
Yeah. You said you guys hiked out and then hitched a ride back into town to get some parts and stuff when your truck broke. I think people needed to be picked up at the time.

Janie:
When I was pregnant with Kim, Von was working on an oil rig at Mile 200, and I was in there for a month as a cook's assistant because they couldn't find anybody else to go to work and help her out. So he says, well, Jane can because she's not working. So I went up there and I spent a month up there at the oil rig. And to get me home, the guy that was delivering groceries took me home. I rode home in a truck, got back down into the settlement. I'm assuming they dropped me off at Grandpa and Grandma's place. I don't know for sure exactly where I got dropped off, but I just remember riding with the food delivery guy coming out of there.

Garett:
Do you know what kind of job he had on the rig when he was up there?

Janie:
He was on the bottom of the totem pole. The guys that packed those sacks of mud and stuff in and what were they called?

Garett:
Are they roughneck?

Janie:
Yes, a roughneck, just for general labor. And back in those days I made friends with the guys that run the water trucks and they taught me how to play gin rummy and stuff because they had time on their hands sometimes. [laughs]

Garett:
Yeah. I also had experience working on a rig as a roughneck. And sometimes it is fast, fast, fast, fast, fast, stop. Wait. Something's broken, got to wait for something else and then it gets fixed and it's fast, fast, fast, fast again.

Janie:
I think probably when you worked on it, you probably get a twelve hour shift. Like when Von was working, they did eight hour shifts. They had three crews. And they actually had four crews because one was off site with their week off and the other three were working eight hour shifts and they rotated that way.

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
And you guys probably worked twelve hour shifts. You lived right in the camps. You lived right there where they were drilling and stuff. And they don't do that as much anymore. You kind of live off site and you drive there.

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
It's a lot different. It's a lot different.

Garett:
Yeah. It's probably safer now and healthier.

Janie:
Because Vera even went out to camps and cooked. I don't know if she went to a lumber camp one time and was a cook and maybe a rig somewhere one time to cook. Because she's a really good baker, like making doughnuts and pies and stuff like that. Vera was really good at that, but she was a really good cook anyway, but she liked that the most.

36:24 - Some Additional Stories

Janie:
So, can you think of anything else? Any questions you want?

Garett:
Yeah. How have your feelings for the Peace Country changed over the years? Like you told us, you lived there for 27 years.

Janie:
27 years. I still like the area. I really do. If it wasn't for cold winters. [chuckles] Being up there this summer, it was just amazing how hot it was because I never experienced hot weather up there. So that was just unreal how hot it got this summer. But it got hot everywhere on the west side of the Northern continent here. It was crazy.

Garett:
Yeah. So your feelings just became more fond over time while being there. And after you've left?

Janie:
Well, because my kids and grandkids are still there. So I really still like going back. Yeah, I do. I could spend the summers there, but not if they're as hot as they were this year. I don't know, although it was worse down here. But the thing I miss most about the north country is seeing Northern lights. It's just the coolest stuff. We don't get to experience that down here. And we were always out late at night. We always got to see.

Garett:
Yeah. Did you see them often?

Janie:
We saw quite a few. Yeah. We got to see quite a few. Miss those. For sure. You know, because people are really friendly up there. For the most part, it's easy to get to know people, make friends. It's a different lifestyle, you know. I mean, when we were living in Cleardale, like you could stop in at any neighbors any time of the day or night and be welcome and come in and have a visit. You didn't have to phone ahead and make arrangements. So it's hard coming back to what you call a civilized country because you don't do that kind of thing around here.

Garett:
Yeah. The little more slow pace up there sometimes. I guess it depends what industry you work in, but different now.

Janie:
Yeah, the oil industry, those people work all the time, some long hours and stuff. It's crazy the way that has gone.

Preston:
In your experience up there, Grandma, was oil and gas always a major industry, or did it become a major industry later?

Janie:
Well, originally it started like at Drumheller area, and it took a long time for those oil companies to branch out and find these deposits. They kind of stayed in the south for a long time, I think. When we were in Cleardale was the first time we experienced any. They come by and, I don't know if it's when they were running the gas line through there or what was going on, but everybody got a little taste of money. But there wasn't too many people doing leases or that kind of thing. Like in the early 80s. It was after that when things really started booming a lot more. And like I say, there wasn't that much going on up at 109 and the 121 either. When Von first, and that land where Joleen, where the Ranch is now, like, you couldn't come in the 120 road. It was just a trail until the oil companies moved in and started doing stuff when they developed those roads because you come in 109 and come on the Gundy and come through that way and you had went back out. I don't know when they actually got that 121 road developed, but it was a some years down the road, and now it's almost like a highway.

Garett:
So did you guys build the road yourself that went down the hill to the cabin or did you contract out or something or who built the road, like down to the farm?

Janie:
Where you guys know the ranch is, on Townsend Creek?

Garett:
Yeah.

Janie:
Yeah. Off Gundy Road. Yup, Von would have built the road down in there.

Preston:
Yup.

Janie:
The original road. The ones that are in there now, a lot of that was done by the oil companies because they wanted access to stuff in there. And so through her negotiations with them, they built some roads down in the farm now.

Garett:
Yeah, right. But those ones, like the one that you never wanted to get caught down at the bottom of with a rainstorm if you had to get out?

Janie:
Yeah. Von built that one in there. That was the original road. Probably Gordon Snyder, who owned that property before, that's probably how they just followed that road in because that was the access to that land.

Garett:
Okay. Yeah, okay.

Preston:
Just straight down the hill, 10% grade in the mud.

Janie:
It was. Yeah and this year with the cat and the hoe they had up there, they hauled a bunch of rock in there and filled in that little crevice that was building and got it all filled in and flattened out and drainage and stuff so it shouldn't wash out again. They did a lot of work in there this summer. Yeah. You don't have to worry about being stuck in there anymore, that's for sure. Crazy. That was always an issue being able to get in and out. That's why, you know, there was no access to schools, because it was kind of like a 30 mile drive to get out. Won-o-won had a school, but to get out of the Blair Creek and get in there, it would have been a 30 mile drive. And like, you couldn't do that with kids. And Von says, well, just homeschool them. And it's like, what? I'm never in the house. How are you going to home school kids where there's nobody there? That's why I bawked at moving in there. I needed to stay where there was the ability to get the kids to school. And Kim went to first year in Taylor school. She had done the first grade there before we moved into Alberta. And so that was one of the things prompting us to move too, was to make sure we had access to schools. It was one of my prime concerns.

Garett:
Yeah, no doubt. I remember my oldest brother and sister starting home school kindergarten in the log cabin when we were there. And pretty exciting to move to Won-o-won and get to go to a school. Basically a two room school house.

Janie:
Yeah.

Garett:
I mean, it was a big upgrade, but the school was pretty far.

Janie:
[laughs] I know. Well like, John and Em Dennis did home school their kids in there, but she was a school teacher by trade and had the ability to teach him. I think they were graduated by the time they were 16. Those two kids. I just touched base with her the last time we were up there was hoping to get to see her, but she'd had a doctor's appointment that day and she wasn't feeling all that great. So I'll have to wait till next time I go up because he has Parkinson's and so she's not doing really well. But it'd be really great to have a visit with them. So it was a lot of hard work. And you know, because nobody had running water. We didn't have electricity for a long time. When we lived on the Alaska Highway, we had electricity, but we didn't have flush toilets or running water. I don't remember having water hauled to us when we lived at mile 25, but when we were just across the highway from grandpa and grandma's piece of property there at mile 22, there were companies that delivered water, so we had a galvanized 50 gallon fuel barrel, but it was just a galvanized barrel out there and they delivered water, 50 gallons of water once a week. And I don't remember what kind of money we paid for it, must not have been very much. But that was your sole drinking water, cooking with, and bathing and stuff, like 50 gallons is not a lot of water when you stop and think about it.

Preston:
Yeah, that's the size of my hot water tank in my home right now.

Janie:
I know my hot water tank is 85 gallons right now because we have that huge bathtub.

Preston:
[chuckles]

Janie:
You know, think about that. And you still had to pack it in the house and pack it out. And that was a lot of work. A lot of work.

Garett:
I've always appreciated having a small taste of that level of work, hanging out on the farm without running water or electricity. It's quite different, especially now living in the city. It's very formative, very helpful in my world view.

Janie:
Yes, people don't have an appreciation of running water and electricity. [chuckles] When they've had it all their lives. You know, I had it growing up, but as I say, we had electricity part of the time. But when we moved into Alberta that first year, we didn't even have electricity. We set up a 32 volt electrical system. We had glass batteries and a little generator thing out in the little shop and run some power in the house. We had some lights and I could run the washing machine when we start that up. But we didn't get power in until sometime that winter or the next spring before the power company actually got power there. And we had minimal lights and things and stuff, but at least we had it then. But we still didn't have running water for a while and packing water.

Garett:
Did you almost always have wood stoves then for the winter?

Janie:
Wood heat, yes. that's a big job, too.

Preston:
Did you also use the wood for cooking as well?

Janie:
I have used wood cook stoves, yeah. We had one up at the cabin, at 109, and when we first lived there at mile 25, had a wood cook stove in there to begin with. Grandma Meservy had one at that place they had on Tower Lake Road, too. I don't remember if she moved it over when they bought that twelve acres, if she had it in that house. She might have on the back porch. But, you know, it takes a long time to heat a stove up to boil some water or anything in the mornings, so you'd have to be up really early in order to get some breakfast before you send somebody off to work. I didn't appreciate that. We got electric stove before too long because that was just way too much work for me. And Kim didn't sleep good, so i never got any sleep. [laughs] She was a baby. [laughs] She didn't sleep good at night for quite a while. You know, I've kept some journals over time, but nothing really spectacular. Joleen wants all my journals, so as i go through this house and start going through all the totes and stuff, i got to get them all put together in one place so i know where they're at and they're safe because i didn't know where they all were when we had this fire situation last week, and i didn't want them to burn up. That's something you can't replace, so that kind of worried me.

Garett:
Yeah. Thanks for talking with us, Grandma. It's been really nice.

Janie:
You bet.

Garett:
Do you have any other thoughts, or Preston, do you have any other questions right now?

Preston:
I don't have any questions right now, but I'm very appreciative because I've definitely heard some sides of the stories or stories that I've never even heard of before. Been very insightful for me.

Janie:
Right. You know, if you need to do another session, you guys, while you're in the process, write down your questions.

Garett:
Yeah, I think if you have any other questions that you want to share with us, we definitely started with some pretty broad questions about your impressions of the Peace Country and, like, you know, the mud and stuff like that.

Janie:
The mud is something you cannot forget.

Garett:
I've met people who've only gone for a little bit and they remember the mud.

Janie:
[laughs] Yeah. My sister and her husband came up one time and they had to drive on some muddy roads to get back home. He said, he didn't think he ever got it off the underneath of his vehicle. It just sticks so bad. I remember him talking about it. Yup. Peace River mud. For sure. It has a reputation. All right. Good to talk to you guys. Think about things. You know, I still have my original paperwork from crossing the border.

Garett:
That's pretty cool.

Janie:
And our immigration papers and stuff. If we ever put a book together, I've got that stuff, which I think that would be a fun thing to do. I mean, I still got my id card from school. I got a lot of things, and that's the things that worry me about getting burnt up when these fire situations start. Some things I got to take care of and make sure these totes are marked well and in a place it's easy to get out of the house for an emergency situation, next time. One of my goals. Okay, guys. Love you.

Preston:
Thank you so much for your time, Grandma, and your wonderful story.

Janie:
You're welcome. Love you guys.

Garett:
Love you, too, Grandma.

Preston:
Love you too, Grandma. You take care.

Janie:
Love you too. Bye.

Garett:
Bye.

Ending Theme Music:
[bass guitar riff with drumbeat]